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Jbirk 54 posts 04-26-03 07:41 Reply	What about the population problem? If you have never seen a population problem, you should see Southern California. The problem is that everyone want to move here! A bunch of old people in Nebraska watch the Superbowl and say, "It is warm in CA, let us move." Gerbals and Pharits are illegal in CA because they breed too fast, but why not people? I mean, the biggest infestation in California is people. Another thing that irritates me about CA: There is this specific group of pelple who do not speeak English nor care to learn; instead, they speek there native language and start some informational places for there kind teaching each other how to use welfare, get free medical services and everything. These people take low paying jobs, e.g. Gardiner, and they do not fill out a W-4 to pay taxes on their income. They currently have entered a bill into the state government requesting that CA label all street sings in there language as well as English. They procreate like gerbals (many have 9 children). At school, our taxes provide them with translaters and some program where they are supposed to learn English even though many never do. They can go to college for free by filling out for some low income/ nobody in my family ever went to college before forms which I might add are available in their language as well as English. They haul their trash down a street on a pickup and dump it where they see fit to avoid paying for garbadge collection. Many are not legal residents of the United States. Many of their children do not believe school is neccesary because they want to follow in their parents footsteps and become equally dumb. I am not going to name this group of people, nor do I want them dead. I am not another Adolf Hittler; I am a simply someone who sees a problem and wishes for an acceptable solution. At one point in time, a person from this group of people approached me and said, "Give me $20, or when you are not around, I will find your car in the parking lot and break your windows." I paid the $20 because I believe it the best insurrance policy I have ever bought.
Yangster 71 posts 04-26-03 08:07 Reply	About the thing about the kids shouldn't be punished for it... In the bible, when King David of Jerusalem sinned (killed his general because he fell in love with his wife), God punished him by killing his son (son of David's wife)... I always disagreed with that... But I would rather a rapists child not be born, in case it contaminated the gene pool...
Dexter345 677 posts 04-26-03 10:47 Reply	I agree with the current government position on this. They got the opinion from scientists on when a fetus could begin to live on its own. Then they outlawed abortion after that time. For the argument that a teenage girl needs to accept the consequences, I think that we should be a little more forgiving. Should we punish a person for one bad choice? I don't think so. Now, of course this means that I think that it's sick that there ARE women out there who are promiscuous, knowing very well while they are having unprotected sex that if they get pregnant, they can simply have an abortion. Rape, incest, danger to mother or fetus, these are all cases in which abortion should be allowed. I think that the main question of this topic is: when is the fetus considered a human? That way we know when abortion is murder. I guess that's why this is under the religion topic. This topic hits a bit close to home (in a manner in which you wouldn't be able to guess, so don't bother), so I tend to be very pro-choice. You may begin hating my opinion now, if you have not already done so. -Dexter345-
bigreddog81 48 posts 04-27-03 02:55 Reply	You know what I find interesting? In the Laci Peterson murder trial, the prosecution is pushing for a double-murder, in that the unborn child should be considered an individual. Hmm... murder... abortion... hmm... (Don't bother trying to say that that's only the case if the mother is attacked too, because to me, abortion is the mother volunteering to be attacked in order to get rid of the baby.)
Xathien 1255 posts 04-27-03 04:22 Reply	If it's rape, they can just put the baby up for adoption if they don't want it. Someone will most likely adopt it someday, and the human life is still preserved. If there is the possibility of great harm or even death in the birth or before, then abortion should be allowed. Still right along the lines of life preservation.
pentatonic184 33 posts 09-22-05 03:44 Reply	Let's say that in the future, the world is over populated by humans (more than it already is) and there isn't enough food to go around and people are dying of starvation and killing eachother over food. Then do you think that abortion and other forms of "birth control" should be allowed until the population thins out. And on the same note, how about gassing the elderly.
Dexter345 677 posts 09-22-05 14:09 Reply	Although you put it very bluntly, I agree that our world will soon suffer from drastic overpopulation (it's exponential, after all) and we're going to have to do something about it. Personally I'd like to colonize Mars, although I don't know how much that would help considering we don't really know what resources we can extract and use. Rather than gassing the elderly though, why not just re-legalize duels? If two consenting adults want to kill one another, and are fully aware of the risk they take, they should be allowed to.
Fr0stbyte124 109 posts 09-23-05 00:27 Reply	How about a free-for-all duel involving everyone in the city that would take place on alternating Thursdays. That should stem the tide quite nicely.
pentatonic184 33 posts 09-23-05 01:43 Reply	If we did colonize mars, where would we get the food to give to them on their trip and the food for them to store on the planet when they get there?
Jeremiah Walgren 1187 posts 09-23-05 18:37 Reply	Overpopulated? You think the world is overpopulated? Where do you live? The middle of New York City? Travel to the middle of Texas. Do you see millions of people around? How about in most of Nevada? Alaska? How about Canada? Lots of people there too? What about the tundras of Russia? The Sahara desert? How many hundreds (if not thousands) of other sparsely populated areas? (Or not even populated, for that matter.) Our world isn't overpopulated. Not even close. People who think it is have a very, very narrow view of the big picture.
Fr0stbyte124 109 posts 09-23-05 19:46 Reply	You're absolutely right. It's only overpopulated where the rest of us live. We should move to Texas. Or move them. I don't feel like moving. More like sitting, really.
pentatonic184 33 posts 09-23-05 21:31 Reply	We're talking about the future, it will get worse (i live in the middle of the woods and never see anybody, but the other day i saw somebody marking trees on my land) it's just a matter of time before they're everywhere.
Jeremiah Walgren 1187 posts 09-24-05 06:53 Reply	The land is filling up with people. Who'da thunk? We still have a good deal of the planet covered in water, if we happen to "run out" of space at some point in time. Floating cities, anyone?
Dexter345 677 posts 09-24-05 14:49 Reply	It's not that I expect people to be covering the entire earth like a mosh pit at a concert. The idea of the world becoming overpopulated is that we will soon have more people than our resources can sustain. There is a finite (albeit extremely large) amount of land for growing food, drinkable water, lumber and ore for building houses, et cetera. And as for the question about Mars, they're planning on taking with them plants that can endure Mars's climate so they can grow their own food. It's pretty interesting.
Fr0stbyte124 109 posts 09-25-05 01:23 Reply	I wasn't aware that anything could endure Mars's climate. Its atmosphere is incredably thin, its almost completly CO2, the soil is barren, and it's quite cold. I suppose they could eat colonies of lichen, though.
Jeremiah Walgren 1187 posts 09-25-05 04:57 Reply	Running out of resources may be a possibility, but a highly unlikely one (I think). If I remember right, plants need carbon dioxide for their plant processess or whatever (I'm not a biologist). If that is the case, they'd love the Martian atmosphere.
Dexter345 677 posts 09-25-05 13:28 Reply	It may not happen in our lifetimes (I'm hoping for that), it may not happen in our childrens' lifetimes, but if we don't do something, it will eventually happen. Ever learn about population curves in math class? Populations grow exponentially until the growth rate reaches a maximum, at which point the population growth begins to level off. This happens because the resources of an environment can no longer sustain a population of that size. Now because we have all these trade routes and whatnot, our environment is basically the whole earth, but as I said before, the whole earth is really big, but it is still finite. So there is still a maximum population that the earth can hold. This is math. You can't argue math.
pentatonic184 33 posts 09-25-05 16:39 Reply	You should tell that to the people in my math class, that's all they ever do is argue with numbers.
Jeremiah Walgren 1187 posts 09-25-05 17:11 Reply	<< This is math. You can't argue math. >> Actually, I can. You see, when God created the heavens and the earth, He created enough and to spare. Math may show one thing, yes, but God changes things entirely.
Dexter345 677 posts 09-25-05 19:17 Reply	Are you suggesting that our resources are infinite? Because I have a couple of conservation laws that say otherwise...
Fr0stbyte124 109 posts 09-25-05 21:14 Reply	Cities will all be overcrowded and people will be malnurished long before the population levels off. They likes to make the babies.
pentatonic184 33 posts 09-26-05 00:43 Reply	What Jeremiah is trying to say is that science has failde our mother earth an that spirit flows through all things.
Jeremiah Walgren 1187 posts 09-26-05 02:54 Reply	Actually, God did this wonderful thing called "planning ahead." He already knew how many people would come to this earth and made more than enough resources to take care of them. Isn't it great to have someone who knows everything to be the project leader?
Dexter345 677 posts 09-26-05 03:39 Reply	Yes, people will be malnourished long before population growth stops. That's what's going to stop population growth. Starvation. That's why overpopulation is a problem; because many will suffer if nothing is done. And Jeremiah, you think that the population is just going to stop growing when it gets to the happy point that your God planned for? What's going to stop the population from going over that?
Dexter345 677 posts 09-26-05 11:58 Reply	Mmm. The Apocalypse?

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